KHov Shocker...

Discussion in 'Sun City General Discussions' started by BPearson, Oct 13, 2015.

  1. BPearson

    BPearson Well-Known Member

    Stopped the other day at the KHov models and briefly talked to the salesman working the floor. I didn't tour them, thought I'd wait till my wife was with me. It's always fun to get ideas from what other are doing that we may be able to incorporate in any remodels we would be doing.

    Anyway, the gist of this thread is contained in my questions to him and his responses. I asked first about a Grand Opening and he said it wasn't necessary, they were having more action than they could handle without a big splashy kickoff.

    It was the second one that threw me: I asked if they would sell out in a year? He said they would have sold out by this December if they could have built them that quickly. That left me scratching my head so I asked what that meant? Rather than paraphrase his answer, I'll take the printed version in the letter he passed out to those entering: "Due to the unprecedented demand for this community, we have no choice but to limit the amount of home sites available for sale and the amount of sales we are able to make at grand opening and in the coming weeks. In order to build your new home with the quality we require, we cannot start more than 1-2 homes per week."

    Knock me over with a feather.
  2. Andria

    Andria New Member

    I am not surprised at all to hear this.
  3. fixj

    fixj Active Member

    BP, production building is complex. Even a " build" several times larger than KHov 5 "starts" per week is highly demanding. Aside from all of the construction issues , permitting, capital, supply chain, trade partners, there is also the doctrine of "scarcity". Nothing sells homes like scarcity.
    Having been part of builds ranging from 500 to 1500 homes my estimate for what they are doing is 70-80 homes a year. AZ has shorter construction times, slab on grade construction , weather, 12 months of building, faster permitting all are in their favor.
  4. Rusco

    Rusco New Member

    Article in Wall Street Journal Tuesday, Oct 13th detailed the build limitations facing new home construction nationwide. Has to do with new labor and build regulations and labor supply. Article indicates most builders are facing same issues. I was not surprised to see entries here and affect on KHOV. Article did not mention KHOV but assume this builder is one of many facing same issues in developments throughout the U.S.
  5. Emily Litella

    Emily Litella Well-Known Member

    Last edited: Oct 15, 2015
  6. BPearson

    BPearson Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the response regarding construction challenges these days gang; just seemed hard for me to get my arms around.

    I've told the story before, but it is relevant given what is happening at KHov: The Webb Corporation started the original Sun City infrastructure on 107th and Grand Ave on Sept 1, 1959. It included the shopping center, 5 model homes, gas station, Community rec center, North Pro shop and the Hiway House (later became the Kings Inn) bar and restaurant and motor court. They did it all in 4 months.

    To amplify that story is from 1968 through 1978 they averaged more than 2000 homes sales per year. I read somewhere along the way John Meeker said they were building 5 to 6 homes a day (do the math and you will see how that works out). Think about comparing the technologies of today compared to the 70's and there is none. Back then, it was a hammer, nails and lots of physical labor.

    I guess that was why I was stunned at the pace, and exactly why we will NEVER see another Sun City like the original.
  7. J_and_V

    J_and_V Member

    Wouldn't the governed aspects of building now vs 1959 also come into play? What were the labor and environmental laws when the Webb Corporation broke ground?

    Yes, I'm sure KHov has that well in hand, but we are talking about what could cause such a dramatic change in the "speed" of construction over 50 years.
  8. Fiona

    Fiona New Member

    My daughters both built homes here for Shea when we first landed. OSHA and other safety factors do come into play and rightfully so. Slows the construction down. What we have to include in homes today to meet code is unbelievable. We have an old 1929 Code book and today the Code book(s) and the reference codes amounts now to about 25 of those 3" thick code books (3" binders). The trades today are spread thin compared even to 2003 when the boom was in full swing here. But even back then the field managers had up to 15 homes ea to manage.
    So it goes.
  9. BPearson

    BPearson Well-Known Member

    Government regulations have created quite the boondoggle (and this from a bleeding heart liberal). Nothing wrong with strong OSHA laws to protect workers but all of the permitting is just another way to collect taxes. The process has become laughable and we all just stand by and watch these ass clowns make it worse.

  10. Rusco

    Rusco New Member

    During housing downturn many construction workers gave up the profession to find more dependable work. Now that there's some housing recovery there's a lack of skilled workers. It's not all regulation and permitting although there's plenty of that.
  11. BPearson

    BPearson Well-Known Member

    I guess it's a good thing Del Webb wasn't born late in the 60's and been trying to build a construction empire in this day and age. He was a card carrying carpenter and there was a time in this country when working in the building trades was a thing young men and women who weren't college educated could depend on those kind of jobs to raise families and retire from.

    Sad to see so much of that go bye the bye. And I'm not lamenting it's an immigrant things so much as an employer always looking for ways to save a buck. Way more to this topic but we'd end up talking about politics far more than construction woes.
  12. Emily Litella

    Emily Litella Well-Known Member

    Personally, I think I was here on opening day. Then something happened and I was born again in March of 1960. Then some SOB told me I had to wait 55 years to come back to live here. :devilish:

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