4/24/2025 Board Meeting No New Business

Unfortunately, we have those that don't listen and stir the pot. Please stop doing this. We are all human and deserve the courtesy of civil converstation. You don't have to like one another - but the mean, rude and downright nasty behavior is uncalled for . . . . please can all act like adults?

With the Sun City sm sites and the toxic behavior, the video of adult seniors stealing from the golf course (news story), and those driving a golf cart intoxicated and killing someone's dog (Nextdoor post) . . . . where the hell are we???? We should be an example, rather. There are many wonderful people in Sun City - let's promote that while expressing our concern over our self-governance. Don't add to the idiocy.

 

It was obvious when i walked in the door, the board had no intention to let anyone speak. The little numbering thing was not on the table and the opportunity to allow members a chance to speak on the mic was best resolved by amending the agenda and allowing for it. About 20 people in the room, so no big deal.

Other than this: The day before i attended the Sun City Orientation with some 200 members present and as good as it was, there was one glaring weakness. No member comments or questions were allowed there either. For some strange reason, the RCSC places more value on one way communication (them to us), than on two-way.

It is what it is, we are where we are, the real question is will if ever change?

 

“There are many wonderful people in Sun City - let's promote that while expressing our concern over our self-governance. Don't add to the idiocy.” ~ SBB

I think RCSC’s paid Communications staff and Communications and Outreach committee should start generating positive media coverage beyond their current internal efforts.

Begin with positive exposure press releases with boiler plate attached, more social media presence, not everyone is a member of Facebook, ability to share, directly embed, RCSC YouTube video stories AND assign a Marketing coordinator within the Communications staff department!

~ Just my two-cents ; )

 

Actually worth way more than two-cents eyesopen. Seriously, marketing this community would be EASY. Sorry to shout, but we lost our way along the way and everything we do seems like pulling teeth. Think about this for 40 seconds: How much good promotional video could have come out from those attending the Orientation the other day?

I'm not talking about the speakers presentation, i know that's posted. I'm talking about interviewing those who watched, listened and learned. Good God folks, this isn't that hard, it's just that's not how we are wired. I keep telling everyone/ no one, everything that happens in Sun City should/could be a marketing opportunity. EVERYTHING!

That's what John Meeker did, they were trying to sell homes. That's what we should be doing but for a different reason; we're trying to rebuild and restore that sense of community.

 

A great promotion example is SCHOA’s next day coverage of the Sun City Orientation, by Beth Lucas, their Marketing Manager. Lots of photos and attendee reaction quotes. It was sent to members on their mailing list. I don’t know if it was released elsewhere. It is available to share, which I have done, including here on TOSC!

 

Some days, all i can do is laugh aloud and scratch my head in amazement. Last night a poster insinuated i didn't know what i was talking about. To rebut her comments i started searching previous comments on TOSC that were pertinent to the topic. Interesting i came across this piece i wrote in June of 2022. As i read through it, it fit perfectly with this thread. Enjoy:
Let's talk about "what if."

What if we created a "welcoming wagon" approach like the old days in small communities. greeting new buyers where they lived?

What if the board said from this day forward we are committed to educating and communicating with new home buyers on a wholly different level. What if each new buyer was invited to a coffee clutch gathering bi-weekly or monthly (5-6 homes sold each and every day of the week; do the math 150 plus homes per month) and the goal was to build an ongoing relationship regarding the best, most effective way to communicate. Newspaper? Email? Social Media? Website? Text?

What if, rather than a 50k survey by ASU, we actually asked those new buyers why they chose Sun City and what they would like to see in the coming years? And then we did it, week after week, month after month, year after year?

What if, as this program picked up steam, we started doing similar programs for existing residents? What if we started to teach them the importance of becoming the owners of a community built on self-governance, accountability and responsibility?

What if we partnered with the other organizations within the community to understand why those organizations mattered as well?

What if we started grooming new buyers, as well as existing members to take an active role on committees, especially ones they had work expertise and experience with/in?

What if we made a commitment to creating a true "symbiotic relationship" between the organization, the membership and the management team?

So, what are the arguments? Too costly? Too much time? Too much work? Who really freaking cares?

This is where i always look back. What if John Meeker had said those things? What if Sun City had stayed the course in 1964 when sales plummeted? Would we even be here?

I told you above, what ifs are invariably exercises of twisting in the wind. We know they have no interest in doing any of the above. The RCSC made a decision 15 years ago to become something wholly different. To move in the other direction. Was it smart? Are we better for it?

I guess we'll never know, or at least we won't until we elect board members who want to change the culture of the organization. One where the members matter. By the way, i watched the annual membership meeting of the RCSCW the other day. My only point is this; they addressed those in attendance and those watching at home as, "owner/members." Not once did i hear them called "card holders." Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

My God, what if we had done half those things and where we might be today?

 

In keeping with the OT, I think this was an informative board meeting.
I think we're back on track or getting there.
I wish we could keep every current board member on the board for another year.
It appears that they are working very hard and again, I say let's be grateful, positive and give them a chance.
Thankfully, this is a big change from even 5 months ago.

 

I think so too E, but we tend to lapse back into the status quo way too often. I posted the list above not because it's something they have to do, but because a commitment to the membership shouldn't be a one-off. We know a couple of years back we defined our Mission, Vision and Values statement, but have we set/determined that member education and communication is a priority?

I would argue, not even close. It is getting better, and frankly i'm not looking at the board to be the guiding light or doing the heavy lifting. I would expect that work to be done by employees within the RCSC who have been given a direction and then acting on it. I know, without a GM telling people what to do, i'm not holding my breath. We know the last one had no interest in social media.

In the interim, while i heard how home sales were back on course to be par with last years 1400 total, that's nowhere near what we need to meet our massive list of PIF projects. I know sales are soft around the country and given what's going on, they may remain that way. I also know there are areas of the country being pummeled by exploding home owners insurance rates and everything Sun City offers is far more livable than other senior communities.

Sadly, me knowing that isn't all that important. We need market Sun City.

 

First, I am thankful that there are folks that want to be board members. In my short history with RCSC governance I have noticed a pattern which I hope is not repeated to the detriment of our recreational offerings. In the past the Board went through the motions to "paper" a conclusion and then went behind closed doors to have the architect design what they had in mind. Then there was the great reveal which understandably fell flat. Then there was the revolt (resignations and recall efforts) and then there was the new board and then wash, rinse repeat... IMHO the reason all these efforts failed was they disregarded the need for the membership to understand what the options were and why one option was chosen over another. In short, only one option was ever presented to the membership which correctly understood that the fox had been guarding the hen house. It is not known whether the current process will be a repeat of the past because the only decision that has been announced is RCSC is not building a PAC at Lakeview. The rest remains to be determined.

 

John,
Perhaps a more comprehensive approach would be to allow the members the ability to say they don’t want a PAC built anywhere. The PAC debacle has gone on for far too long. It has delayed the process of getting MV done for years. The members don’t support it, so why does it continue to be a consideration by the architects? Why are we wasting money to attempt such an elaborate and expensive design that is not warranted or needed in this community? In my opinion, the PAC is a want, not a need, and we NEED to be focused on what the community NEEDS to be successful, sustainable and attractive.

 

Agree 100%, glad you said it. It's probably way to logical though. When I said pretty much the same thing, I got a verbal thrashing because I am me. You go girl.

 

My method of reaching the members to query the desire a PAC would not be a voting process, but a simple questionnaire, with easy to understand “yes” and “no” responses applied. Simple and to the point.

 

And an architectural firm who thought that Lake View was the perfect spot for a PAC is now looking at Mountain View again?

So who's actually making the decisions?

What we don't need is a new space dedicated to a single venue, which means we're back to a flat floor!

 

Curious from those favoring a flat space venue: Do you consider the 300 seat tiered seating setting in Sun City West a PAC?

 

No opinion as to what SCW has. Every time I try to bring in comparisons of other communities, I feel that because they aren’t Sun City, they are not valid comparisons. So, as has been repeated many times, we are two different communities and cannot and should not be comparing ourselves against SCW.
What is at SCW is built to their desires. And their assessments reflect the costs of maintaining those venues. So, they pay more to help maintain whatever the structure is and how it is utilized. Is it needed for the community to function? Or is it used primarily for a performing area? That, in my opinion, would make my opinion as to what it’s called. What is the utilization of the space? How often is an event scheduled that requires the retractable seats are a few questions I would like to be answered before answering.

 

From information gathered, the facility use the SCW Kuentz Stardust Theater has become a challenge. The theater portion has ceased showing films at the facility for a reduced rate due to lack of interest from the residents. The group that leased space at the facility has stopped due to an IRS issue. This leaves the Theatre West Club, the local performing arts club as the only group utilizing the space. So, based upon the known former and current tenants, it could be called a performing arts center. Looking at the groups that were supporting the facility costs are now gone, the total costs of operating the facility falls to the members. Just more information about the pitfalls of operating a venue utilized as a theater type facility.

 

Curious? Where did you find that information?

 

SCW Theater West (Stardust) old website
Theatre West Productions | Theatre West Club

New Website
Home | Theatre West Sun City West

It states IRS on the new site, not sure where the detailed info came from. Don't forget they also have the 50 seat Ghostlight Theater by Safeway which appears to cater to school age kids presumably due to their close proximity to Surprise Schools.
About Us

 

BILL,
May be some confusion about the Stardust Theater group & Theatre West Club.

• Theatre West Club Hiatus
(RCSWC)Theatre West Club activities and performances are on hiatus.

This board's primary focus is addressing the club’s unresolved tax status with the IRS. In addition, they will handle essential tasks, like bill payments and required reporting, to keep the club in good standing.
https://www.theatrewestscw.com/

•Thursday night movies are coming to an end in Sun City West
The final Thursday night movie at the Stardust Theatre will show in June.
Sun City West Independent
Posted Saturday, April 19, 2025
https://www.yourvalley.net/sun-city...-are-coming-to-an-end-in-sun-city-west,577182

 

I suspect not all of you follow Sun City West, i know my knowledge is limited and not all that focused on what goes on there. That said, i did pay attention a few years back when Bill S was hired at the new GM to replace Mike W. Mostly was the commotion that took place when Bill was hired. They had done an audit on club membership and found several of them had allowed non-residents to join the clubs, or were attending events in large numbers. Adding to the woes was the question whether the store they were running (to sell club made craft items) was deriving more than 15% of their sales from non-residents.

I know the shit hit the fan and the changes angered some, but it was the right call. Sun City West is a 501 C 7 which is more stringent regarding outside participation than our 501 C 4 status. By the time it shook out, a lot of changes were made, including closing the store. Clubs became more diligent in who could participate.

Thanks to both Josie and eyesopen for the information. I wasn't surprised to read they stopped showing movies. Actually, i'm more surprised we still do. Although, it looks like we are trying to bring in newer movies, it's challenging given the streaming options available.

I know my old friend and fellow historian, Ben Roloff, had gone to a good number of plays in Sun City West. Anyone could go online and buy tickets, which may be the reason they are looking at the Theater West Club and the 15% threshold. I'd be surprised if the issue was non-resident/members being performers, but who knows?

The reason i mentioned the West theater was during the SAC, much was made regarding the size (300 seats and roughly 10,000 sq feet), and the fact it was utilized a lot more than i had expected. Those statistics were cited again in Nov of last year when Karen McAdam used both SCW and a large community to the east (Green Valley?) claiming utilization percentages in the 75% range.

I have no idea whether they were accurate or not? As we have discussed any number of times, data matters. That said, true data matters even more. I'll stop back later and explain my concerns regarding retractable seating. Thanks to Tom Marone for sharing his information. Nothing is ever as easy as it sounds and any investment we make should have solid footings as we move forward.