Okay, No one is thrilled with the outcome of the bylaws rewrite. The board is not going to allow members comment on their decision to move forward with this matter. This is indeed a very serious matter in the history of Sun City and the RCSC. The decision to do this process in complete secrecy and exclude member input and a vote on these by the members is telling of how the RCSC does not feel transparency in its dealings in order to create trust in the corporation, a tenet described as essential for a successful nonprofit corporation. I write all of this in the hope that the name calling stops and once again return to a manner of civility. Disagreements of opinion will occur from time to time, but there’s no need to make any more attacks against anyone else moving forward. Please stop calling each other out and for god’s sake, stop calling each other names that are not practical or needed to complete the conversation. I implore everyone to please be respectful of each other’s opinions and keep the conversations going and refrain from making any further disparaging remarks. Thanking you all in advance. Carole Martinez
Thank you, for taking it upon yourself to voluntarily monitor member behavior & actions, without any official role or mandate from TOSC group administrators. Good reminder.
You are correct, Carole. I do wonder why you defend the person who violates this tenet so frequently and with the most volatility with insults, name calling, and obscure comments.
Janet, I am sorry you feel that I defend his behavior as this message was written just as much for him as any other person. My reply to the single comment he made was in relation to cards being dealt and how we need a redeal. As to my knowledge I have not shown favoritism towards him or any one else. As a matter of fact, I have called him out by name in previous threads for things he has written. So, my request was for not just one person, although one person has been most prolific. Carole
It is my understanding that one person has been banned from posting on this site due to name calling and offensive statements. I don't think anyone has been more egregious about insults and name calling than Dave. Others are guilty as well. I try not to do that even though I admit I keep their feet to the fire over things that have been said or the work they have done, such as the recent bylaws proposal. Why do I see a double standard here?
I have a different perspective about the bylaws rewriting. Had it been just Dave that did the work by himself, then he deserves full on bashing for these things that are written. He was part of a committee, one that involves other members as well as four directors. Dave is the only one posting on here. The others have chosen not to participate in the process of explaining or expanding on their work to make these changes come to fruition. Dave has chosen to be on TOSC and make comments about various topics and issues beyond what I would have said. By the same token, I am not him and he chooses what to say or not say on any given topic. We are friends but I am not his keeper anymore than he is mine. I have taken him to task previously on other threads and have been blunt about my comments. The bylaws work is, in my opinion, an atrocity. What’s worse is the members are the ones who will suffer because of these actions. This ultimately rests with the board and they are the ones responsible for making decisions against the community. These are going to take a board decision to make the right choices to do the night things for Sun City. Sorry, computer went down mid stream and half of what I wrote is gone and the other half is not in the vein I wrote the original text in. Sorry for writing and rewriting the same post.
I am referring to all of Dave's posts over the last several years not just about the recent bylaws revision. He has been demeaning, insulting and name calling to many, many people. Why is he allowed to continue his banter when others aren't?
I am not in a position to prevent the comments from happening yet. I have taken your concerns to heart and will continue to be vigilant in what I say and do going forward. That is the best I can offer at this point.
How do we report him to the TOSC administration? I understand that you are familiar with who that is.
I believe if you scroll down to the bottom of the page, I think there is a contact page. I have not been there in quite a while so I am relying on memory. There was, at one time, I think a way to report items, but I don’t know if that feature still exists. I will not comment any further on this issue. I have tried to be as transparent and informative as I can be. Apparently what I have tried to convey is not what was wanted, so it best for me to make my amends and beg off.
TOSC Terms of Service and Rules (Excerpt) “You agree to not use the Service to submit or link to any Content which is defamatory, abusive, hateful, threatening, spam or spam-like, likely to offend, contains adult or objectionable content, contains personal information of others, risks copyright infringement, encourages unlawful activity, or otherwise violates any laws.” https://www.talkofsuncity.com/help/terms ➡️ To report offending content for review: Tap REPORT that’s on the lower left of every post. AND Tap CONTACT US at the bottom of the page on every thread, right hand side in black line.
I no longer fit in on this blog, but I just want to say something that may surprise some of you. Our BOD is operating in a 2025 method of operation now. We are not operating like 1970, 80, or 90's any longer. The hard truth from all of this is that the members, ( the residents) folks living here for the most part, want the BOD to operate this way. You only have literally a handful of folks even bothering to attend the meetings. I myself do listen online, but I have to believe that the majority don't. People are no longer interested in coming to every meeting and voicing on every single line item, bylaws and all else. We want easy, no sweat style of governance. I again do not feel as many as you do that there is something diabolical being drafted behind the curtain. These folks are taking time each week out of there day to make decisions that the majority can live with. Everytime I get on this blog you guys are predicting the ultimate disaster and end of the world. I have to believe that the majority of retired folks, don't seriously give a damn about bylaws and every single line item that you guys are questioning some kind of malfeasance too. Unless you can prove to me that this place is going to do a nosedive to disaster, I am with the majority. I feel our elected BOD IS focused and making sound decisions to make our little place run as efficiently and solvent as possible. We are not going back to running the place like 1960. Folks will not show up, and people want the modern streamline processes to continue. I fail to see what all the fuss is about. Sorry, but I don't agree with your corruption angle.
I love when posters talk about the 60's and 70's as if they were a bad thing. Really Eileen? Yup, sense of community, sense of ownership, responsibility and accountability were truly an awful way to exist. Thank God, that was instilled in the community at the onset. Too bad, those qualities are passe. Far better to let the board do as they please...that's worked out so well for us hasn't it? This is what we got when we abandoned the checks and balances built into the documents: 1). Quorum increase to 1250 with no membership meetings for 12 years. 2). 20 million dollars in deferred maintenance. 3). Technology 15 years behind schedule. 4). Grand Center being built while Mountain View was kicked to the curb. 5). Golf hemorrhaging money with no plan other than cheap golf as our salvation. 6). 3 general managers in the past 5 years. 7). The library debacle. 8). The RCSC refusing to let members vote at their membership meeting. Pretty impressive eh?
Sorry to see you go, Emily. I wonder where our country would be if people didn't speak up when they feel it is going the wrong way.
Bill, The really sad truth is that 'the folks' aren't showing up for the majority of the management of this place. People don't want to get into the weeds of running the place. The 20 million in deferred maintenance and money that will be spent is the hardest issue we face now. We are 65 years old and we have a lot of old buildings. Maybe we need a corporation to run the place. Remember Del Webb Corp. did run this place in the beginning. You mentioned some salient facts here, but even with these facts, do you think part time retired people are able to take all of this on? Del Webb himself may have never thought about what happens to these communities when they are getting old. I know you have outlined before me all of your worthy points here, but I am telling you that residents will only get roused when something is going to affect there bottom-line. Too many on here are living out your life by dissecting every decision that has to be made. I think some of you are letting this affect your everyday existence. If that is so, then get back in there and try to make it right. I just don't see evil intentions, just human beings, some flawed, some right, some wrong, trying to make a difference. Just turn on the TV and see how it is being done on a federal level. Keep pitching if that is what you need to do, but just understand, your mixing amateurs with some professionals and this is what we are going to get. Also, I need to add here, Many of you on this site are solely in the business of putting up roadblocks for the sake of roadblocks. NO BOD, can function and accomplish tasks and goals with this mindset. People are turned off and have tuned out, and that is what is making the 60's at least feel sweeter, simpler and member-board friendly. I do love the past, but the world no longer operates with such proprieties and that's why we have this present on-going never ending turmoil.
Very well said. To add to that, many of the folks who buy here do not do so because it is Del Webb's Original Sun City. They like their house; they like AZ; they like the added amenities; but they do not want to get involved. Unless something BIG happens - like the library fiasco - they do not show up or care. We can't make them get excited about "community." I do think that RCSC could do a much better job of orientating new buyers to the community, but all the information in the world isn't going to make them want to get involved. Eileen - you have added some good advice over the months and you "care"; Thank you. I totally understand about dropping out. I am, too. I did what I could when I could and don't regret any of it. Until Management puts together a better Welcoming Effort (better written material, welcoming coffee, Ambassadors of Sun City), I'll be taking a time out. Jean Totten
