Nov 21, 9 am start time.

Yesterday at the special session former board director John Fast asked a question that may have not gotten the attention it deserved. It was simple; did the board factor in new buildings being added to the 5 year financial study the budget and finance committee is proposing. The CFO said clearly, "no."

Here's why it matters and it is an issue many of us have understood. If we are replacing a building, it may come with a more efficient structure that helps contain costs. If we are building, buying or adding additional square footage, that is simply a cost plus deal.

The argument new buildings are being paid for out of the PIF is correct; the supporting costs for maintenance and utilities comes directly from our yearly lot assessment. It is why Tom Marone and others have argued against more amenities. It's why John's question mattered.

With that out of the way, let me address an item before i get to the meat of the thread: While my one "admirer" will rant about my opinions, i will and have stated a hundred times, what i write are simply my opinions...no more important than any one else. I am more vocal and there is a reason why.

I did exactly this for a living. Running a local union that was membership driven meant part of the process included me satisfying the membership enough to re-elect me. It also meant i had to be articulate and capable of writing and speaking in ways the members understood.

When i moved to Sun City i knew these skills transferred easily. That said, i also understood from our history, my voice was no louder, no greater than the next member. My vote no more valuable than the next. It was the beauty of how Sun City was built and why we were so successful. It was a collective process where the members voices mattered.

Yesterday's meeting strained the bonds of that belief for me and the other 300 members in the room. Not one voice spoke in favor of the PAC and when the dust cleared, the board plowed ahead with plans to build the theater on the lawn bowling greens at Lakeview.

It was a fascinating display in our process that has served us for so many years. We're nowhere near done yet, but this thread has gone on long enough. Feel free to join in and add your thoughts we are just 10 days away from our next gathering.

 

Thank you Bill, for your history expertise. Thank you to John for asking that question. Thank you to Tom who knows Robert's Rules.

Too many of the Membership of Sun City do not know about the Articles, the Bylaws, the PIF, CIF, and even the discussion that took place yesterday regarding the placement of a new Performing Arts Center (PAC) at Lakeview where the current Lawn Bowling greens are. Many just don't care. Many have no way of knowing since they might not be signed up for Email Blasts or may not get a free newspaper. I'm not going to debate here that's it's their responsibility to know what's going on around them. In a perfect world.....

When I inquired years ago (before my time on the Board) about taking the vote to the entire Membership (like what happened way back when concerning the Sun Bowl), I was told that it was not a good idea and wasn't necessary. I was told that the Membership votes in representatives who they feel will represent them and how they feel.

Yesterday was a good example of how that doesn't work. Did you vote for any of the folks up on the stage? Did that person or persons listen to an auditorium full of people who did not want the PAC at Lakeview? Or did they vote the way they wanted to?

The Articles of Incorporation are the first order of reference in all things RCSC followed by the Bylaws. Below find portions of the Articles that I have read and tried to interpret to pertain to the situation that we are in. If you notice that some numbers are missing - like #4 - it's because I interpretated that it doesn't pertain to the topic at hand. I also left out ##6-#13. I'm not a lawyer; I admit I do not know what some of those items are saying.

RESTATED ARTICLES OF INCORPORATION
ARTICLE III
The general nature of the business in which the Corporation is engaged is as follows:

To do anything and everything lawfully necessary in the interest of the Members of the Corporation, including, without limitation, the following:
1. To establish and conduct a general social, cultural, recreational and amusement enterprise for the benefit of its Members and do anything lawfully necessary or convenient to accomplish such purpose, including, but not by way of limitation, to purchase, acquire, develop, sell, lease, own, operate, and manage ((NOT BUILD)) theaters, playhouses, agricultural projects, riding stables and corrals, libraries, opera houses, golf courses, baseball and football games, tennis courts, dancing facilities, lawn bowling rinks, horseshoe pits, croquet courts, travel clubs, card games, shuffleboard, swimming pools, skating rinks, lecture and conference rooms, and facilities and equipment for such arts and crafts as ceramic work, sewing, woodworking, leathercraft, lapidary, photography, fine arts, jewelry, shellcraft, mosaics, etc., and any and all facilities necessary or incidental to accomplish the general purposes of the Corporation.
2. To coordinate, implement, and aid the various recreational and social clubs which are now or which may become duly recognized as such by this Corporation.
3. To promote cooperation in all matters of interest and benefit to the residents and/or homeowners of the area within the bounds set out in Article I, who become and remain Members of this Corporation.
5. To purchase, lease, option, contract for or otherwise acquire, take, own, hold, exchange, sell, or otherwise dispose of ((not BUILD)), pledge, mortgage, hypothecate, encumber any and all classes of property necessary to the fulfillment and furtherance of the objects and purposes of the Corporation within the limits prescribed by law.

With this stated, where do we go from here? Recall all Board members? Recall the Initiative? Create our own Referendum?

TIME IS NOT ON OUR SIDE! The next vote will be in 9 days. Some of the hoops that we have to go through whatever we decide have to be accomplished in a set number of days. TIME IS NOT ON OUR SIDE!
Jean

 

And that's why I now ask, "If we build a PAC at Lake View, does that mean we can demolish the building at Mountain View and build more Pickleball courts?"

Just another opinion!

 

That's just another piece of the puzzle we know nothing about Tom. Once they dump the PAC on the Lakeview greens, then apparently we get to see what the elements are/will be at Mountain View. Talk about the cart before the horse.

I was a huge of fan of the SAC. It was Sun City at it's finest. That was until i saw the competing agendas. Even with it, Plan M coming from Marlene (the architect) made the most sense at the least cost. It would have allowed us to get it moving. In reality, it should have been done years back, before they built the Grand Ave center.

Yesterdays news; today's is this burning desire by the board to build a PAC atop the Lakeview lawn bowling greens so it has a beautiful lake frontage setting. After hearing about the wine bar, coffee shop and boardwalk, it sounds far more like this will be a destination rather than a venue for performances. I don't know, maybe that's critical to our future? But honestly, that would be like me arguing lawn bowling is critical to our future. Both are something we will do going forward, not a feature that will draw Gen X and Gen Y to the community (in my opinion).

Sun City's history is filled with internal battles over direction. There is absolutely nothing new about what we are witnessing in real time. It is what happens when there is no local governing body; no city planning dept, no mayor or city council. We are left to stand up speak out and hope to God they listen. Most of the time in the past, they have. Monday we saw a board who was tone deaf.

The next test will be Thursday November 21 at the Sundial auditorium. The meeting starts at 9 am, so if you want to speak for or against the motions, you need to sign up before the sheets are collected and brought to the stage. My mantra has never changed: Sun City works because of those living here. They should be heard; the question is will they?

 

Exactly what I said about Plan M when I spoke.

And please come even if you don't want to speak, rather support those that are speaking in agreement with you.

Thursday, Nov 21, 9 am - Sundial - don't forget to sign up to speak if that is your desire.

 

I'm not on Facebook so I can't post this, but I hope somebody and everybody who reads this will!

We need to fill the auditorium in the same manner as we did for the Library leases.

We need to back the Board into the corner, and let them know that in no uncertain terms, that we do not want the location of the PAC at Lake View to be determined unless or until they do a full development study for the complete renovation of the Lake View Rec Center and property.

Please pass this along to everybody you know and to every Social Media venue that pertains to Sun City!

Thanks.

 

As you all know request for petitions were filed today to recall all nine directors. This is a sad event, but it appears to be the only way to get the individuals on the board to listen to the majority of the members. There are other nonviolent/nonconfrontational actions underway that undoubtedly will bring bad press to our community. The you versus us stance taken by many board members and management go against everything I worked so hard to correct. It is so avoidable and could be a root cause of the increase in "bad behavior" we are seeing. I am devastated.

By nature, I look for solutions not problems. The solution to me is clear. Director Collins simply needs to move to withdraw his motion, and the board needs to hold a planning session next year to reveal what the real possibilities are. As my colleague Gary Osier points out, it is irresponsible to try and piecemeal a redevelopment plan for a community as large as ours is. The ad hoc pieces never fit together as well as if the plan was fully developed before implementation began.

Best regards and God Bless,

John

 

One thing that is apparent from our history is no matter the issue, there has always been a solution, resolution. Some more difficult and demanding than others; this too shall pass. I suspect a week from today, some of the resolve we saw on Monday will begin to waver. I strongly suspect even the most resolute will have come to understand the mere look of trying to shove everything through in the space of 3 weeks was foolhardy.

The Tri-Arc presentation was released on Oct 31 (where they announced they wanted the PAC on the water at Lakeview), the first vote on Nov 11 at a "special session" (that was poorly thought out and conflicted with two directors schedules), and the final vote on Nov, 21. A total of 22 days, where the board introduced a totally new and vastly different proposal to the membership.

I know the some of the board thinks the lawn bowlers are driving the bus on this...let me be clear...it is any number of members of the community that are incensed. While it would be easy to argue as a lawn bowler against the proposal, i am far more disappointed the board would even attempt this in such a short window of time and without adequate feedback by the community.

There's a more important component in play here. Several of us said it at the meeting. It is easy to get emotional over clubs being displaced, but the bigger more far reaching question/challenge is the big picture Lakeview remodel. When we do it, we best get it right. It will be the largest, most expensive renovation in our history. Whatever is done there should be well thought out, well executed and embraced by the membership at large.

The very idea we throw up a building on the water front now and then 5 years later execute a plan around what a previous board did (in 3 weeks) is crazy. Any board member reading these words need look in the mirror and ask themselves...does this make any sense...at all.

The whole discussion about the recall is interesting. Here's why: By the time the petition is given, signatures collected (assuming they get the required 10%) and a vote scheduled, we would be into next year. By then we will have lost a couple of directors and gained a couple of new ones. As we know, directors can and have changed direction from previous boards. And, let me be clear; should the board take an action (like John suggested above), the recall petition should just go away (in my opinion).

This is exactly how Sun City works. Boards are elected to serve the membership. They take actions and when the membership voices their approval or disapproval they respond. This process has been in play since residents began moving into the community the end of April, 1960 and the first member driven groups were formed by the end of the year.

I like to call them "teachable moments." We'll see eh?

 

Hi Bill,
Putting the PAC building on the lake, will no longer be a lake-park. The open inviting park and place of relaxation, views, our Christmas events and just coming to walk, play lawn bowls and take a stroll will be forever altered.
This was kind of our gift from Del Webb to have a signature place to view and beauty. I don't see how erecting a large structure offers residents a place to go and enjoy and relax. The building will forever obstruct the views for all of us to enjoy.
Again, PAC at Bell makes more sense. Please don't mess with our natural aesth gift Del Webb gave please. Do we not care about quality of life here in terms of our natural setting, which is a gift.

 

I appreciate the honest and open sharing on this site. I pray that our elected board volunteers take our concerns seriously. Thank you.

 

After watching the end of special session video it seemed a few board members were expressing some indecision and hesitancy towards the motion. The meeting on 11/21/24 will be interesting.

 

One of the reasons i love Sun City history so much is because of situations like this. The fear of the unknown is always the worst place to be. We know over the past 64 years, these kinds of situations, this type of turmoil has happened repeatedly. We also know, it worked out.

Over the years i have been asked by candidates running for the RCSC board if i had any sage advice. My one answer was always, listen to the members. I know that's not always easy with differing points of view and bias. Which is why the bigger the question, the more voices they will hear. Sorting it out is challenging but doable.

A week from today will be interesting, for sure.

 

No narcissism here. "advice that is wise and judicious, often as a result of great learning and wide experience"! Had to laugh so thanks! Ed McMann baritone echoes in my mind, “And now, the great seer, soothsayer, and sage, Carnac the Magnificent.”

 

That was a joke skit.

 

Wow! Can you say sarcasm Dave? You are embarrassing yourself.

 

Rumor was that, that was going to happen, but they sure are quiet about it! I have not heard a word other than your post on this blog????

I don't believe this is the proper remedy and will not be signing the petition even if asked.

IMHO, the correct petition would simply be to not lock in a location for the PAC at Lake View.

 

I read an interesting thread on SC Advocates today. By the time I went thru it twice I almost feel like we should incorporate and put this BS to bed. After all we are controlled by "The Gang of 9" anyway. Residents mean nothing.

 

7pm, Thursday, Nov. 14, and no agenda out for next Thursday Nov. 21 Board meeting. Cutting the 7 day notice really short.

 

Wow, you are right, it normally comes out on Thursday. Technically Friday works.

 

Access November 21 Board Meeting docs, explore Fairway's history video, and meet the candidates on YouTube
!!RCSC E-notification received
11:26 pm, Thursday night, Nov. 14, 2024!!
➡️ VIEW with active links: https://mailchi.mp/b66a2c7e30d7/exchange-video-link-7786365?e=f18f779945

November 21, 2024, Board Meeting Documents
Access the agenda, minutes, and financial reports for the upcoming Board of Directors meeting.
• Balance Sheet - October 2024
• Public Income Statement - October 2024
• 10-year PIF Forecast - October 2024
• Treasurer’s Report – November 21, 2024
• Board Meeting Agenda – November 21, 2024 • Changes to Board Policy Number 12 – December 19, 2024
• Board Meeting Minutes – October 31, 2024 • Management Report – November 21, 2024
• Bylaws (V) 2024_12_19-Current 11-12-24
• Changes to Board Policy Number

History of Fairway Recreation Center
Explore the rich history of the Fairway Recreation Center in this engaging video. Learn about its legacy and impact on our community.
Watch the Video:


Meet the 2024 Board Candidates
Get to know the candidates running for the RCSC Board of Directors in 2024. Watch their introduction videos and hear their vision for our community.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdLy0Uy9sKWCJNLz37tn5ug

More candidate info can be found on our website. Click here:
https://suncityaz.org/2024/10/18/rcsc-announces-candidates-running-in-2024-elections/