Society's Challenges...

I don't deny the climate is changing. What I am denying is that it's caused by man!

If man could control the climate we'd be able to control the weather!

 

If climate change is not caused by man, how is it being done? Are you thinking along the lines of the Little Ice Age of the 1300’s? Do you know what caused same? Please cite reputable sources and I believe you will probably Google the answer.

Happy New Year

 

Have you heard about a thing called a "natural occurrence?"

It's been going on for millenniums, even when no one was around to burn fossil fuels! In fact, the world's been warming since about the 1850's and there's really no proof that CO2 actually causes warming, but there's proof that plants do grow better in the presence of higher levels of carbon dioxide! That alone improves the lives of many people in many county's.

Hurricane's? They say 2005 was the year with the most hurricanes when 15 formed and they blame that on global warming. But according to NOAA and the National Hurricane Center, the 1940's was the most prolific decade with 24 hurricanes, 10 of which were considered major.

If you still don't believe that climate change is a natural occurrence, go out into the Sonora desert and dig for seashells! Yup, 200 million years ago the desert was an ocean! Or go up to the Arctic and check out the drill core samples through the ice and you will find remnants of well preserved plants.

The only answers you will find from GOOGLE is the same phoney pablum you believe in! Try reading the book Climate Confusion by climatologist Dr. Roy Spencer and learn the truth about those so-called government reports and how and who created those reports. But here again, you seem only to believe in the books that agree with you own twisted beliefs!

 

Arctic Cold Snap predicted

The weather is about to get dangerously cold, even for winter | CNN

Just a heads up Cave Creek is supposedly the best place to find Fossilized Seashells. Personally I prefer to look for real ones on Sanibel Island tho.

 

You are correct about seashells which was they coexisted with the volcanoes which are part of Arizona. Look for the chunky black rocks called basalt. Do not confuse with the mountains that were caused by upthrust. Actually the ocean you are talking about covered portions of Arizona, New Mexico and the western part of Colorado. Dinosaurs roamed NW Colorado into northern Utah. Great museum in Vernal, Utah and I believe there is a Dinosaur National Monument park there.

While plants do like CO2, the heavy deforestation in the Amazon and SE Asia is threatening the CO2 exchange. Also, fossil fuels are producing more CO2 than nature can handle, consequently the last natural resource to store CO2, the oceans, have about hit their limit as they are warming and turning into carbonic acid. I could explain that but I barely passed organic chemistry at uni, aced inorganic though.

I see that Dr. Spencer currently at uni of Alabama, but consults with The Heartland Institute in Chicago, founded in 1984 whose purpose in climate change denial (I have followed them since their founding) and The Heritage Foundation in their climate change denial wing (interesting to see what bubbles up from this bunch the next four years). Both of these are also part of The American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) who buys Republican legislatures and drafts climate change denying legislation, restrictive voting laws, liberal gun laws, etc. During her tenure in the AZ legislature Debbie Lesko was State Chairman. If you don’t believe me, ask Rick Gray as he was a member during his tenure in the legislature. ALEC had annual conventions with trinkets from the sponsors you wouldn’t believe along with fabulous dinner and alcohol. All of this is true, ask Rick and/or Debbie.

 

There is no doubt that there are denyers on both sides. Some deny that man causes climate change, and some deny what those deniers are saying!

Truth is, there has been predictions for many, many years that climate change is an existential threat, meanwhile, Life goes on! The oceans may be rising but land is also sinking.

If you throw a rock from a rowboat into a lake, will the water level of the lake rise or fall?

The water level will fall because the rock displaces more water when it's in the boat (due to its weight) than when it sinks to the bottom of the lake (where it only displaces its own volume) which is less water overall.

Kinda makes me wonder about icebergs? When an iceberg melts does the ocean level rise or fall? The iceberg floats because it weighs less than the water it displaces!

 

And God forbid congressman says Guam will tip over and capsize due to troop build-up, so we must be careful how many people occupy small islands.

 

You guys are way beyond my reach with your understanding of global warming. Tom's remarks regarding Dr Spencer's book did send me searching for a more thorough understanding. I found a fascinating site where there was a solid repudiation of his work, none of which i am posting. Unlike many comment sections, this one was driven by genius nerd-like scientists who were clearly big-brains on both sides of the argument. I read through nearly 100 of those comments and one in particular stood out to me:

Here it is (credit to Mal-adapted, as his remarks i could get my head around):
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"Spencer’s scientific credentials make him well-qualified to construct specious disinformation, and he’s on record as rejecting important aspects of the consensus of his peers for AGW, but we mustn’t dismiss his scientific claims just because we know that about him. Accordingly, Gavin has rigorously evaluated the substance of Spencer’s arguments on their merits, and found them to be misleading. Gavin explicitly disavows making the argumentum ad hominem:

I don’t criticize Spencer (and Christy before him) because of any tribal or personal animosity, but rather it is because appropriate comparisons between models and observations are the only way to see what we need to work on and where there are remaining problems.

Thank you, Gavin! With our due diligence done, we’re allowed to speculate on those two credentialed scientists’ cognitive motivations for propagating disinformation. Since Spencer made his latest claim in a non-peer-reviewed article on behalf of a notorious American conservative stinktank, we might ask “What more do we need to know?” Well, leaving pecuniary interest aside, why might Spencer and Christy stake their reputations on reanimating the undead “models are unreliable” denialist meme again, when it’s been iteratively slain already? As other RC commenters have often pointed out, one answer may be found in their shared religious faith. Both are open about their Evangelical Christianity, and have lent their names and credentials to the Cornwall Alliance for the Stewardship of Creation, an organization of evangelicals and their corporate allies (Russell came up with Cornball Alliance, because how could he not?). In 2000, the organization issued the (a href=”https://cornwallalliance.org/landmark-documents/evangelical-declaration-on-global-warming-2″>Evangelical Declaration on Global Warming. Its signers declare, among other things:

We believe Earth and its ecosystems—created by God’s intelligent design and infinite power and sustained by His faithful providence —are robust, resilient, self-regulating, and self-correcting, admirably suited for human flourishing, and displaying His glory. Earth’s climate system is no exception. Recent global warming is one of many natural cycles of warming and cooling in geologic history…

We deny that Earth and its ecosystems are the fragile and unstable products of chance, and particularly that Earth’s climate system is vulnerable to dangerous alteration because of minuscule changes in atmospheric chemistry. Recent warming was neither abnormally large nor abnormally rapid. There is no convincing scientific evidence that human contribution to greenhouse gases is causing dangerous global warming…

IOW, evidence be damned! One could scarcely ask for a more forthright repudiation of the basic principles of science. Spencer is listed among “Notable Signers”; though curiously enough, Christy is not. Spencer’s pretty testy about it, titling a blog post Science and Religion: Do your own damn Google search.

Like anyone else, I hope to avoid making ad hominem arguments, but Gavin’s thorough rebuttal of Spencer’s new claims tends to justify my prior skepticism of any scientific claim Spencer makes.
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Just out of curiosity i searched the percentage of scientists believing in global warming? This response is from the NASA website: "Yes, the vast majority of actively publishing climate scientists – 97 percent – agree that humans are causing global warming and climate change. Most of the leading science organizations around the world have issued public statements expressing this, including international and U.S. science academies, the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, and a whole host of reputable scientific bodies around the world. A list of these organizations is provided here."

It's an interesting conundrum, with those who don't believe in the science of global warming and all of the data that comes with it, do believe in the bible...a document that has been written, translated and convoluted over the past 2700 years.

 

As usual you are correct. That will be my mantra from now on. Yes, you are correct. Think of all the time saves!

 

Tom, first I will skip the rock thing as it is not worth it. As for icebergs, 90% of an iceberg is below water and the volume of the ice as a solid is equal to that as liquid. Sorry, my explaining physics is equal to that of organic chemistry but I believe you know what I mean. That said, one iceberg will have a minimum effect on the sea rising, but a number of ice floes the size of small States will have an effect due to volume. I barely passed physics knowing only one formula, F=mg. Don’t get me started on college math.

 

Another Myth Busted on man made global warming!

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2025/01/another-myth-busted-latest-report-reveals-30-year/

 

Sorry Tom, but this guy is a clown with a clown website. The number and intensity have increased in the past three years. Also his chart is bs as he left off the Gulf coast with hurricanes such as Katrina a class five with hair on it and the hurricane that followed a week later, sorry don’t remember the but was a class four. The destruction in New Orleans in 2005 was beyond catastrophic. I know I saw when I went to Jazz Fest the next year.

Summing up your source, nothing like presenting a small part of the picture and say I proved my point is not making it.