Nov. 11 Special Session

Since the PAC project was already decided by required board final vote, February 2024, would the next step be filing an Initiative petition to reverse it? Petitions require signatures of 10% of the membership who must be in good standing.

Initiatives, Referendums & Recall Petitions
Before an initiative petition is filed, the party or parties intending to circulate and file such a petition, will submit the proposal (in the exact language that the initiative will contain) to the Board of Directors. The Board will have sixty (60) days from the date of submission to accept or reject the proposal. If the proposal is accepted, the petition will be assigned a petition control number by the Secretary of the Corporation.

See: Regulations for Initiative and Recall Petitions
If issues can be resolved without the petition process, the Board and the Members will achieve savings in terms of dollar costs and time while avoiding disharmony and divisiveness in Sun City.

I. STEPS TO TAKE BEFORE CIRCULATING A PETITION – INITIATIVE OR RECALL

https://suncityaz.org/2012/05/03/rcsc-board-policy-resolution-no-5/

 

Does it really matter anymore? It's obvious the board will do what they want. Chris' post about a petition is a great idea and I am willing to work on that. Boards over the past 20 years are acquiring more and more control and we are losing our ability to have a say in what happens in this community.

 

No doubt about it! Even though the Petition Process is the only way we can change this, there are just way to many Members who don't care or know enough about the situation to be involved.

I think the time and effort it would take to proceed with the Petition Process would simply be a waste of time because the cards are stacked against the Membership!

I think a better idea would perhaps to be concentrating and putting our efforts on amending the Bylaws and the Petition Process? TRUTH BE KNOWN!!!!The only 10% requirement in the Articles of Incorporation is for the removal of a Director. The Bylaws are incorrect to state, "Per the Articles, any initiative, referendum, or recall petition must have a total number of signers not less than ten percent (10%) of the voting Members of the Corporation as of the preceding July 1."

The Articles of Incorporation actually says: ARTICLE IX, 1. A petition for a removal election of one or more Directors, specifying by name or names the occupants of the seats whose removal is desired, signed by not less than ten percent (10%) of the voting Members of the Corporation as of the preceding July 1st, may be filed with the Secretary of the Corporation not less than ten (10) days preceding a regularly scheduled meeting of the Board of Directors..."

We can certainly amend that 10% requirement for items other than the removal of a Director! Perhaps we should shoot for something less?

 

There is not one person on my street in favor of this PAC. The golf groups are talking about another hobby. I guess the passes are too expensive now. You and John are the attorneys who get it all. I don't, however I can help with the grunt work.

My gut is telling me this place will turn into something no one will want to buy into. There are posts all over Nextdoor about the crime. Someone moved here from Phoenix to feel safer and now they don't. Just about every vehicle that has to park in the driveway has been broken into. Christmas decorations have been stolen. Someone got stabbed 5 houses away from me. Have not heard a thing about it. All I know is they are emptying out the house now. I have so many flippin cameras up now it's crazy.

Fix up what we have now, make SC attractive again. Get compliance officers out there. And for the love of God do not block the only pretty place in SC with a huge monster building we don't need.

 

None of the PDF links work here. Are they somewhere else on the site? Getting a 404 error

 

I have in writing from my many emails to the Board that they will have a 2nd reading at the Nov 21st Board meeting.

Please show up tomorrow at the 9:00 AM Exchange meeting at Sun Dial to either speak or just support those that are speaking in line with your views.

If you aren't sure if you can stay for the Special Session, make sure you raise your PAC comments and questions at the Exchange, just don't make the same comments at both as we'll be there for the entire day. Thank you to those that are going to take an interest in the spending and decisions being made for the entire Sun City community.

 

Is that one of your famous death threats or are you going to hold a class on Dickens in Lifelong Learning?

 

ONLY non-PAC comments allowed at the 9am Exchange:
Quote from Scott Tynes’ Sun City Independent article:
“Membership was not allowed to comment after the presentation, but Tom Foster, board president, said there would be opportunities for members to comment in a special session immediately following the exchange meeting Nov. 11.

He said because comments could be made at the special session, the board would limit exchange meeting discussions to non-PAC issues.

The board intends to vote on the location at the 9 a.m. Nov. 21 board meeting after hearing from the members.“

 

Do you know who David Copperfield is?

 

No, I wrote the Board and they agreed with my concerns - they will ask for comments on PAC to be reserved until the Special Session if you are able to attend, but they cannot refuse PAC comments at OUR Exchange meeting. Again, confirmed from my emails to the Board.

 

I would hope so Susan, this topic will be one of the more contentious issues and actions the board has taken. I suspect they think this will be an easy sell; it won't. I just heard they had not bothered to let either the shuffle board club nor did the electric motor boat club know what they were doing.

I've told the lawn bowlers the best action to preserve the greens is to grow the club. Data should be the driver in all of our decisions, not emotions. My guess is emotions will be running high tomorrow as this clearly looks like it is being jammed through quickly and with scant information available. That doesn't reflect well on the board or management.

We'll see eh?

 

Hmmm! The more that things change, the more they stay the same!

 

I agree with everything Bill said. If rcsc members allow decisions to be made without data and meaningful member input (i.e., the Board runs roughshod over the members) I believe the outcome is predictably a community shaped by the personal preferences of nine members. Different names same result. For the short time I was on the Board I was terribly disadvantaged because I did not have a single-issue agenda. I advocated for a master redevelopment plan for the community. That got little traction, and I think I understand why. Such a plan is invasive to Management's authority and cozy relationship with contractors and takes power away from board members with singular agendas. Moreover, many members are not willing to speak up because they feel their views don't matter and they will be punished by management/or ostracized by their peers if they express their views.
I am a very different breed who does not care what others think at the moment. I have been punished by current board members and management for standing my ground. The current board executive assistant reminds me of this every time our path's cross. I wear that punishment as a badge of courage.

My bottom line is this: Stand up or be stepped on. The choice is yours. Hope to see you tomorrow.

Best regards and God Bless,

John

 

I try not to attack anyone on the board personally, it is a thankless job. BPearson

Good Lord Pearson you attack everyone who does not agree with you 100% I must say you are truly amazing. Some don't realize when their self-importance time is up. Tag, You are it! You are starting to embarrass yourself. You are not the end/all be all of Sun City. Like all of us you will die. Give it to the next Gen!

 

There you go, problem fixed. Simply block the white noise from those who know nothing and could care less about Sun City. Thankfully it is a tiny minority of those who participate on this site and just as small a portion of those who live here. Great to be able to deal with the adults in the room.

One of the more interesting aspect of our governance is the difference between us and Sun City West. Their TORCH program helps set the plate for potential candidates who run for the board. They come in with a good basic understanding of the community, their duties and expectations. We've never come close to developing that kind of program or training. We elect people and hope they know what they are doing.

As John pointed out, not letting personal agendas impact their actions is difficult. It magnifies as the general manager exerts his or her authority and creates an atmosphere where they become the go to source. We watched that happen for 10 years or more and the results were more of a bartering system where there was an endless quid pro quo where board members projects would get done with the board relinquishing more responsibility to the GM.

I would argue it didn't serve us well. It appears as if we are facing a return to those bad old days. I truly want to see the "elements" that are attached to the Mountain View project. It will tell us a lot about how and why the PAC got shuffled off to Lakeview and built atop the lawn bowling greens. Was it a trade-off? I'll reserve my judgement till i see what happens, but the speed the PAC is being pushed through is disturbing and disappointing for sure.

 

We should not have to wait for anything Bill. Full disclosure by the BOD is most appropriate. I am starting to recall how outstanding and transparent the BOD’s are going to be. No better time than now for the BOD to show us what they got!

 

Nor did they "bother" the Lakeview home owners. Imagine that . . .

And again, this is OUR meeting and it's not acceptable to force us to sit around 3-5 hours to voice our opinions on what they are going to vote on. I know many that can't stay for both sessions.

Good decisions are not based on emotions and backdoor deals, and we need to stand up or watch our money continue to be spent unwisely.

 

If this white elephant is built, I want a reunion show featuring NWA, Snoop Dogg and Two Live Crew.

 

Our lovely Lakeview with it's unique beauty and charm will be gone forever. They could find another spot, but they won’t. I am really unhappy with this leadership. I'm sorry but that GM I fear is behind this. I don't trust that man.

 

Sun City as I knew it 20 years ago is gone. At this point it doesn't matter. It's obvious residents don't matter and have not mattered for about 15 years.