Sun City Foundation - New Board Members

“Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive”

Hmmm? Seems between the RCSC, the Sun City Foundation and the Sun City Property Holdings Corp., they can pretty much engage in anything they want to with the ability to filter any donated or grant dollars thru one of the arms of the parent organization? It's just a matter of how they want to use those sub-corporations!

 

Speculation?
Trust the new experienced Sun City Foundation board members to perform as designated.
Legal counsel has already been consulted.

 

Oh! I'm not saying it's a bad thing! It opens up unlimited potential and opportunities for open-minded, out of the box thinking.

 

FYI, I believe I was told that it was an LLC. I can ask Kevin for both of our edification.

 

It'll be good to know but I would have thought it would have been titled as an LLC?

 

FYI, the LLC is a wholly owned subsidiary of the RCSC. The RCSC holds all the stock in the LLC.

 

The bigger question would be has the Sun City Holding ever collected a dime during its life span. I know back when it was started a lot of us were questioning what was the point? Still not sure to this day if there was one?

 

I believe the main purpose of the Holdings Corp. is so they can sell property's with more than an assessed tax value of $50,000 without requiring a vote from the entire Membership.

 

FYI, that is not correct. The Holding Corp. files liens against the property with the purpose of collecting at closing. The problem that might rear its ugly head is if there is a mortgage or other claimant that has priority claim like a bank on a reverse mortgage. RCSC would be subservient to those claims. If the superior claimants are given all the proceeds, RCSC gets nothing. That is scenario number one. The second is the only memorials (claims in legalese) are RCSC, our attorneys would begin a foreclosure action. If no other claimants come forward, such as heirs who want no part of this, the attorneys would then petition for an order of foreclosure. Next would be a Sheriff’s sale where an auction is held. Generally people or companies come to these to get property cheap. The point of this is that the liens are still active and to receive the property free and clear ( more legalese saying you own the property) they would have to pay the RCSC the money due on the liens for which RCSC would then issue a release.

Sorry it is long winded but I wanted you to understand the process and how it works. Any questions, catch me the town hall tomorrow.

 

Still curious: Did they ever use the Holding company, file a lien and then collect on it? If so, what happened to the assets from the sale?

 

That’s exactly what I was advised several years back when researching if the Holding Company could somehow benefit an “insider” buying a RCSC held property as an investment.

Confirmation:
“SUN CITY PROPERTY HOLDINGS, INC.
CORPORATE BYLAWS Adopted September 12, 2016
WHEREAS Article X of the Articles of Incorporation (“Articles”) provides that the shareholders of Sun City Property Holdings, Inc. (“SCPH” or “corporation”) may adopt and amend the Bylaws of the corporation (“Bylaws”).
WHEREAS the corporation’s intent to engage in the business of real estate is solely for the function of accepting foreclosure assignment of real estate in Sun City, Arizona from the Recreation Centers of Sun City, Inc. (“RCSC”) for the purpose of collecting all amounts due the RCSC and associated legal and collection costs.
WHEREAS RCSC shall be the recipient of any profits distributed by the corporation as the sole shareholder.
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED the corporation shall adhere to the following Bylaws:…”

Document on RCSC website

 

Okay, it may not be the main reason but it is one of the reasons.

Suppose the homeowner of a home that was under a lien bequeathed that home to the RCSC, the SCPH could then sell the home without having to get any permission from anybody. And as it stands now, the only thing they can do is handle foreclosures?

This is the story I heard from a former Director; the Grand Avenue property was purchased by the RCSC for $750,000. Shortly thereafter, they were offered I believe $1.1 million dollars for it. The excuse I received when I asked, was that they couldn't sell it because it would have required the approval of the RCSC Membership.

My point being, first of all, I believe the Grand Avenue property was probably a pet project for the Board. Lets face it, we didn't need an 8th recreation center and the location isn't in the best location.

Next, the only Shareholder Members of the SCPH are 4 Board members and someone from senior management.

Had that property been purchased under the SCPH, it could have simply been sold for a very nice profit and all that was required was a Special Session to be called to amend the Bylaws so that they could do more than simply foreclosures. Don't forget, their Articles of Incorporation gives them great latitude and a very broad authority by stating that the corporations Initial Business is "to engage in the business of real estate."

 

Bill, I spoke with Kevin about this a few months ago. He advised that we have collected fees from the liens at closings. This is when we had a superior position (more legalese). Not collecting on all tells me of our inferior position (even more legalese) to, in all likelihood, financial institutions, at closing who were entitled to all the proceeds. The proceeds we did collect were in fact member assessments so the money went to RCSC, I know of no action thus far that involved a foreclosure action.

 

Not to change the subject but....can somebody PLEASE explain to me the specific difference between a Member and a Cardholder?

The Bylaws define Cardholders as, "Cardholder(s)” is defined as a Member and/or Privilege Cardholder(s)."

So which is it? The more you read the bylaws regarding "Cardholders" and "Cardholder Privilege's" the more confusing it gets!

My point being, if there is a difference in the classes of Membership, only then can the RCSC apply different fees to each class? I think?

 

My Member/Cardholder experience:
When I first purchased property in Sun City,
I was still working full time.
Didn’t bother to get a RCSC card.
Card was only required if I wanted to vote and have full access to centers and amenities.
When I retired, I got my official rec card, becoming a Member and Cardholder!

Privilege Card Holders are not required to be property owners. They do need to qualify as residents of Sun City, 55+ or 19 or older living with. a 55+. Think 55+ renters or parents/ grandparents who are property owners with 19+ year olds residing with them. The qualified non-owner resident can purchase a privilege card to enjoy RCSC centers and amenities with no RCSC voting rights. They are not a member, only a cardholder.

 

FYI, the purpose of the law is to make things perfectly unclear. “First we kill all the lawyers.” Henry V

A member is an individual(s) that own property in SC and are named on the deed. A member is entitled to a member card after paying required fees, which has privileges, such as voting, speaking at meetings, being on committees, etc. as defined in the by laws. That person holds a member card. A person who does not own property yet lives in SC such as a partner, significant other, a family member,etc. This individual can purchase a privilege card which allows them to utilize the amenities of SC but not privileges a member enjoys. Both hold cards (physically) but one is more equal than the other, to paraphrase George Orwell.

 

Hmmm? So if you are a Cardholder, you can use the facilities but you can't vote or run for the board!

Makes me think about the "equal rights" thing again because isn't a Cardholder also a Member in good standing if all their fees have been paid?

 

A cardholder can be a non property owner, like a renter. They don’t pay annual assessment fee, have no voting rights.Their landlord,” who owns the property they reside in, pays the annual assessment fee and has RCSC voting rights.
A Member cardholder must be a property owner and has voting rights. Considered a member in good standing only if current with their assessment fee payment.

 

My mildly amusing story about the difference between a Member and a Privilege Cardholder. I moved to Sun City to take care of my mother and at that time got a card and was a Privilege Cardholder. I became involved in the putting together of the Duffeeland Dog Park Club (not to be confused with Best Friends Dog Club) and would go to the BoD meetings and discuss various things with them. At one meeting the BoD President pretty much attacked a member who was being a real crank about something and more or less drove him from the room with his tail between his legs (to use a dog park metaphor. Or is it a simile? Anyway) So I wrote a letter to the paper saying that although I sort of agreed with the President that that speaker was being a jerk, I did not like the way the BoD President handled it. The next time I went to a meeting I got up to speak and was informed that the Bod had decided that folks with Privilege Cards no longer had the right to speak at meetings. After my mother passed on I shelled out the $4000 or whatever to stay in the home I’d been living in for years, but I never did go back to a meeting. I guess that rule was since rescinded, but . . . . ..

 

McIntyre: Residents can decide if qualifications met
Posted Thursday, October 24, 2024 Sun City Independent. No subscription required.
• You be the judge;
https://www.yourvalley.net/sun-city...dents-can-decide-if-qualifications-met,542112